To 'argue against the man' misses the point of discussing the logic, the truth, the validity or the lack thereof of the actual arguments expressed. Personal attacks are ridiculous, particularly in the context of tomatoes. I protest strongly use of this list as a forum for vituperative, hateful personalities, and further protest that anyone would use a public forum to publish personal attacks. Use off-list for your hate; leave me out of it. Further, all the bad emotion kills tomatoes. William Dellinger