>hi tom..yes sorry about the general pacific northwest location..what i was >referring to would be the willamette valley in oregon...thanks much ..pam If you're dealing with a lot of overcast, as I know my parents are in their location in Dundee, just outside of Portland- I'd be tempted to try a few San Francisco Fog. It was pretty decent for me in Marin County (SF bay area). Regards, Laurie Wappingers Falls, NY